Bad orc :( Should I restart the course?

[Ricna]

Ok… So, after 2 months after to abandon my “Orc” and this course I decided to finish this no matter how.

I was struggling too much redoing the topology because the unwrap part and also a lot of times was backing to sculpting and… An infinite loop So I basically gave up.

Today I started from the latest version of my “Orc” and decided to NOT change the sculpt and/or topology anymore. So I just unwrap the model quickly to start the painting! But then after more than 10 hours (unwrapping and stating to paint) I realized that probably because the topology and seams my painting is basically impossible to reach a minimum acceptable result in some places.

The hand of my model is a mess… I made a hand with fingers because I would like to be able to animate her hands further, but… looks like I will not be able to

What you guys recommend do to with this model? Should I restart from sculpting? Should I just pretend that is acceptable to my sculpting/retopologizing/unwrapping?

Thank you a lot! And the course is AMAZING! Grant is a really great instructor. I have to say is the best course I ever made in 40 years, but I’m feeling so frustrated at this point even knowing that is normal (with 20 years of experience working as programmer where more than 10 was in the game development industry animating I already was aware to face this kind of thing, but maybe not so much )

I really would like to start to work with modeling instead programming and animating. I think the most hard part probably is the retopology (?), because seems that it defines how smooth/clear the model will be, or better, how “natural” will be to painting the model later…

Also I think I’m denial to paint, is so frustrating not been able to make a simple line (and I’m using a tablet (Wacom CTL-4100).

So that’s it… What do you guys recommend? Thank you a lot!

[FedPete]

The Orc course is not about, who makes the most beautiful Orc creature.
All entries I’ve seen, including myself, are not Disney level.
But you will learn or master the process of creating a high poly object and bring it back to a low poly object for game engine and or animation. So you need to keep it simple to understand and learn the workflow.
Then practice a lot on new models, increasing the difficulty.

You can spend a lot of time on details, which are not needed or can be done in a different way. Or create a problem further in the process. Forcing you to go back …
Just be patient, follow steps explained. And after you are confident build your own creature.

And after the modeling, you need to rig this figure. Which is also a job on it’s own. A process which can also lead to the need of changing the mesh (low poly). Which leads to new UV-maps etc …
So try to learn al those steps. And use simple models. Use an Orc with tree fingers for example.
So many thinks you need to consider at the start of a project.

[Zangk]

I would agree with @FedPete, the course is not about creating AAA standard quality models, but learning the process and system, and to get comfortable with it. It is in that comfort that will prop you up so that you can make good quality models when you need to, and knowing when that need is necessary.

Your “Bad Orc” is better than what many may post as their best. But so long as everyone is learning to the best of their ability, quality is a matter of time and experience as with most things. I am sure your first program is nothing like what you write now.

Besides, while most students will opt for the standard ham fists, your “orc” has fingers!

[NP5]

Mostly I would say learn, practice hand retopology. The auto methods are easy but not good on the whole. All the other aspects seem fine for a first go.

[Ricna]

Yeah. I got it… About to learn… But, so you think that is better to get another model to continue the course? I know I will need to rig and then animate the character, and that part is not my concern until now because I already have some experience animating in other tools. Anyway i’m not sure about how hard will be to rig my model as I can’t even paint it correclty because the topology is a mess

I’m thinking in move on with this model no matter how, but perhaps it will be impossible?

Thank you

[Ricna]

Sure! You are absolutely right! I’m still improving my codes every time, we are learning and improving every time mainly in this area. Thank you for your words, I know that is not a terrible model for the first time, but anyway I would like to improve it to get the best of the course. Now I know that would be better to stay more close of the Grant’s model to finish the course fast, but now maybe is better to just finish with this model anyway… I’m just afraid that maybe I’ll struggle too much to rig and so on, that’s why I’m asking so if would be better to restart.

I mean, do you think I’ll have problems with this fingers and seams to rig and animate too? Painting is absolutely impossible in some areas, but that’s ok, I got the general idea and I can see what I did wrong, but anyway I would like to just finish it since/if I can with this model.

Thank you

[Ricna]

Yeah! For sure! I started to do it manually when I was in that lesson where Grant explain about the this process, but to finish the course in a short time I decided to use the auto method suggested. Now I think that maybe would be better to have spent some time with retopology to avoid this issues I’m having now. I’m not really sure about what would be better in terms of time and learning, but now seems that I’ll have more problems because the mesh is not good for painting and probably it will impact to rig and animating. What do you think?

Thank you!

[b4t54ndw1ch]

In addition to what everyone here has already stated (and some very good points, too!) I would also like to add the notion of using multiple projects. It may seem like a lot of extra work, but it isn’t, really.

Instead of making several changes with different tools in one file, I like to copy a base file over several times, and try out one tool with each different file.

Like, my last project was Unity 2D Delivery Driver, but instead of making one game, I copied the files and made ten different versions (dd0, dd2, dd2, dd3…) to try little things in each file, instead of tying to put all of my features into one game and confusing myself. I also don’t spend as much time trying to overdo it with one tool right away. Each file only needs to be a little different from the others. Now I’ve got ten sandboxes to test things out. It’s really easy to do with Blender.

It’s just a couple of things I’ve learned on my development journey. It’s not as much work as it sounds like. I hope it helps.

Oh, also, your model looks great. I’m still in the low poly course so your stuff is definitely a few steps above what I can do in Blender. I can tell you put a lot of time into your work!

[Ricna]

Dude! I swear I stared the screen reading you message a couple of times to understand and imagine what you are saying … I mean, seems amazing but maybe a little crazy too, I don’t know if I got the idea correctly too Do you duplicated your entire folder of your Unity project 9 times and renamed it to get 10 copies in some moment of the development so then you could work with different things in each one? But if you add a feature in the dd9, where is the “final version”, it is the dd0? That part I dont get I think… I can see some advantages ,but more if you don’t know yet what are you creating. I think that if the features already was very well defined in the GDD, there’s no reason to be afraid of adding features in the project directly, in any case why not to do these tests using branches for each new feature? Or the use of braches is the same concept you are talking about? In the end seems that it is

Anyway thank you for your feedback, good luck with your course too! And I’m still curious about your method. Is a very interesting thought

Thank you!

[FedPete]

@Ricna

I’m thinking in move on with this model no matter how, but perhaps it will be impossible?

No, no need for.
Because, also rigging can be done in a simple way ( just manipulation the hand) or in a difficult way, rigging all fingers, rigging the face.

You can even opt in for shape keys, to manipulate fingers or hand poses.
And that is what I mean by learning. If you learn the wide range of Blender tools and or processes.
So many solutions.

[b4t54ndw1ch]

You’re not too far off. It’s similar to using branches, but a little different.

I’ll usually complete a lesson and then copy what I’ve done over to other folders like you mentioned, dd0, dd1, dd2, etc. I don’t always make ten copies, but usually 3 - 5 at least.

As I’m re-creating each folder, I don’t do everything the same way. If I need to write a script for dd0, then I’ll copy that script over to the other folders (instead of re-writing it) and then go inside Unity and hook it up to the game objects, etc. Then I’ll push each file to it’s repo.

I do this specifically for a few reasons.

1. Completing a lesson only once isn’t enough for me. I often find that when I try to duplicate my steps in the subsequent attempts, there is usually a much more efficient way to do things. I usually have this written out in my notes by the 3rd or 4th work though.

2. I end up learning several different ways to do the same thing and I end up writing very thorough notes for reference while doing it.

3. Not every game is intended to end the same. For example, one version of my delivery driver game will get some UI elements as I go through that class. Another version might feature a man who gets in and out of the car or something completely different.

4. They’re not all intended for release. I’m going to keep adding things to all of them as I continue through the classes and each version will end up being very different, which is why I don’t want a bunch of branches off of one github repo. They’re not all intended to be the same final game.

5. The biggest reason I do this though is to find the lowest repeatable tasks, things I’ve only done a few times, and do those tasks several times…like hundreds of times.

I used to have trouble opening new packages so I sat for a few days and opened hundreds of packages in Unity, HTML, React, React Native, Flutter, Rust, Go, whatever I could think of…and I ended up with this huge playground of a bunch of different works in progress to try things out and take notes.

It really helps me out a lot as a developer to have a bunch of places to try stuff that I’m not ‘emotionally attached’ to. “Writing for the trash can” as they say.

I can open something and play with it, or forget about it, no worries. It’s all in git and the good stuff rises to the top.

[Zangk]

There is also another possible solution to your problem:

It sounds like you want to figure out how to rig your model, but you are a little intimidated because it might break or you might have to start over. So instead of starting from scratch, why not make another project and copy the model over to that and then use that model to experiment on?

That way you will have two separate projects:

1. The original
2. Another to experiment on.

Whatever you do to the second will not break whatever you had already accomplished in the first.

Likewise, you can make any alterations to your second model (the one you copied over from the first) that you can break to your hearts content. Not happy with those complex hands? Ball them up and call them good! Want to try to rig them? Then do so knowing that your original model remains clean and untouched.

Here is where you can make all the mistakes you want. If you break things too badly, just start over with another project. Likewise, if or as you break things, let them break. Bring lots of pictures and questions over here and you might be an answer. If so, then you will be helping the community out by broadening its solutions pages for anyone else who may run across the same issues.

Once you have figured out the process, then you can consider applying that process to the original (or a third project if you are particularly wary).

If you have tried all sorts of things and ways, asked questions, and end up at a point where there are no solutions, you have done what you could do. You can restart or move on.

[dougwarner59]

I know how you feel; I had to do mine several times and It still wasn’t quite right. I got frustrated and gave up for a few times, but I kept forcing myself to keep trying. Anyways, I think you did a really good job. And about animating your model you can always first import it into Mixamo and use one of there animations to see how it works out before rigging it yourself. At least that’s what I plan on doing. Of course, you may already be finished because this was posted quite a while ago.